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TOPIC: Which guidelines to use?

Re: Which guidelines to use? 1 year, 1 month ago #434

Obviously we have no control over the whole site, either in the frontend or that backend. A lot of the site is under our control, however, from the core layouts, to the admin template which few people change, to the html code and javascript that we serve up, to the example that we provide.

If we don't do our part, then no site made with Joomla can be accessible without considerable effort.

Re: Which guidelines to use? 1 year, 1 month ago #436

  • adrian
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Yes.

One point is, joomla need a concept and more diversity to control the accessiblity. Accessibility is not primary a core feature. I think, joomla need a layer between core and templating to manage the template challanges for template designers.

For example tabindex and accesskeys could be automatically assigned to an path of positions and modules in rows and lines. Because a custom editor wouldn't pay attention to customize the fields for accessibly efforts.
Last Edit: 1 year, 1 month ago by adrian.

Re: Which guidelines to use? 1 year, 1 month ago #437

Well, that might just be an example, but tabindex and accesskeys aren't very popular anymore for accessibility on websites.

Re: Which guidelines to use? 1 year, 1 month ago #443

adrian wrote:
For example tabindex and accesskeys could be automatically assigned to an path of positions and modules in rows and lines. Because a custom editor wouldn't pay attention to customize the fields for accessibly efforts.


Sorry, but I cannot agree. If you were to use tabindex and accesskeys they need to be assigned in a way that makes sense to *your* content and site design. I cannot see any way that they could sensibly be assigned automatically.

Even in an HTML5 template where maximum use of semantic markup is made, it would still not be possible to automatically determine what is important or not. The only way that this could sensibly be implemented is by the template developer, though even then it would ignore the importance of content on the site.

Re: Which guidelines to use? 1 year, 1 month ago #444

andrea.tarr wrote:

If we don't do our part, then no site made with Joomla can be accessible without considerable effort.


Agree 100%. We have to do what we can. People will always be able to break that with poorly written / implemented content but as long as the core validates properly, out of the box, against some sensible set of accessibility guidelines Joomla has done everything possible to ensure accessibility.

Re: Which guidelines to use? 1 year, 1 month ago #448

  • adrian
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If you were to use tabindex and accesskeys they need to be assigned in a way that makes sense to *your* content and site design. I cannot see any way that they could sensibly be assigned automatically.


Ok. First, it's better to have a sheme for accesskeys as to have it not. On many sites there exists shemes. If a joomla item is logical defined or tagged as "terms & conditions" the accesskey can be set automatically to by a sheme. By supporting shemes for access keys there is no reason for disorder. Example sheme: www.direct.gov.uk/en/Hl1/Help/DG_020463.

The tab cursor scrolls through the hole page by tab and shift+tab. The tab cursor jumps in the direction of the html structure if there a no tabindex attribs. This behavior is not very usable. It's better to set the tab cursor first to menus, then to the content area and highlight the pseudo-element :focus for fields and links, to show the tab cursor.
Last Edit: 1 year, 1 month ago by adrian.

Re: Which guidelines to use? 1 year, 1 month ago #449

It only makes sense to assign access keys based on module position (which would have to done at the template level) and content (which we cannot know). Example, you should have an access key for the site map, as this is not a core Joomla component it is impossible to define an access key within Joomla.

With tab index, if you are going to set it explicitly, it would again be tied to the *percieved* importance of the site content. This will largely be determined by the site builder.

It is entirely correct that the default behavour would be to follow the html structure and should be, if you markup is correctly considered and stuctured, perfectly adequate. Only when you would like to 'force' the natural order would a tabindex be suitable and that would be entirely context and content dependant.

Re: Which guidelines to use? 1 year, 1 month ago #450

  • adrian
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Joomla cannot know the link to a non core component like a sitemap. But this is not the root problem. Content with joomla isn't defined at all, only the default site.

Therefore you have to define every item for accesskeys in a sheme (accesskey (9), semantic tag (sitemap), link (com_xmap)), if there is no sitemap component installed, the sheme cannot work and joomla should not use it or should only use it limited.

With tab index, if you are going to set it explicitly, it would again be tied to the *percieved* importance of the site content. This will largely be determined by the site builder.

Right. I think this is bound on a special template or a template convention and not attached to the core.

It only makes sense to assign access keys based on module position

But the purpose of accesskeys is not to reach regions in a layout, accesskeys should reach default functions on a website.
Last Edit: 1 year, 1 month ago by adrian.
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